[Cob] earthen floors

[Jill Hogan]

Hey my toilets are dry compost toilets, work as well in their own rights as the floors do. Love my house more and more, ye good cobbing
Love JIll
Minimum energy for maximum production

www.mat.org.za
023 625 1533

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Ron Becker 
  To: Jill Hogan 
  Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 3:49 AM
  Subject: Re: [Cob] earthen floors


  Hi Jill, it needs oxygen to cause trouble. If there isn't much air in 
  the bag you are in good shape. I did a rifle stock in regular linseed 
  50 years ago. Never had trouble with it drying. Could be you particular 
  sand/clay ratio is ideal for absorbing it. Could be because your 
  toilets flush backwards!

  Ron
  Living and playing outside the box.
  On Nov 18, 2007, at 12:39 PM, Jill Hogan wrote:

  > Hi,
  > I have never had any problem with linseed oil. My grandfather did 
  > beautiful wood work and always sealed it with equal portions raw 
  > linseed oil, meths and vinegar and finish is wonderful. Can pour 
  > boiling water over your table and it doesn't stain. Just popped the 
  > linseed oil cloth in a bag with the oil until next application, didn't 
  > know that it self combusts.
  >
  >  Re the floor I just put my linseed oil/turps mixture and the next 
  > morning it is fine. Never had areas that don't absorb. Do heat it 
  > slightly so it absorbs well. And now my floors are just a treat and 
  > copied all over in natural building.
  > Jill
  >
  > Minimum energy for maximum production
  >
  > www.mat.org.za
  > 023 625 1533
  >
  >   ----- Original Message -----
  >   From: Shannon Dealy
  >   To: sly at riseup.net
  >   Cc: coblist at deatech.com
  >   Sent: Saturday, November 17, 2007 11:37 AM
  >   Subject: Re: [Cob] earthen floors
  >
  >
  >   On Fri, 16 Nov 2007 sly at riseup.net wrote:
  >
  >> Hello everyone,
  >>
  >> I am about to do an earthen floor on a small cottage in spain.  Can I 
  >> do
  >> it with just clay and sand and not use roadbase?  And do I have to do 
  >> it
  >> in layers?  I am looking for the easiest way because the floor doesn't
  >> need to be fancy.
  >
  >   Road base is not required, it is used because it has high compressive
  >   strength and absorbs very little water.  The biggest problem with 
  > earthen
  >   floors is getting them to dry since they are at the coolest point in 
  > the
  >   house, so using a mix with a low water content and tamping it in 
  > will get
  >   the job done much faster when you consider the drying time.  As far 
  > as
  >   layers, you will need to do a minmum of two layers on top of the 
  > drain
  >   rock base, a coarse high sand cob type mix (possibly with roadbase 
  > in it),
  >   followed by a thin finish layer.  Make sure you get each layer as 
  > close to
  >   level as you can manage and it is MUCH more work to fix leveling 
  > errors
  >   in the next layer up.  For your earthen layers get each new layer as 
  > dried
  >   out as possible before adding the next one, it will take much longer 
  > to
  >   dry out the floor if the lower layers are still wet.  Use of a large 
  > fan
  >   can significantly improve drying times.
  >
  >> I was hoping we could do sand and clay and then seal it with linseed? 
  >>  And
  >> how toxic are the fumes gassing after of the linseed, would it be
  >> dangerous to sleep in the room for sometime after sealing it with 
  >> linseed?
  >
  >   Things to know about linseed oil (a number of misconceptions have 
  > been
  >   posted on this list in the past):
  >
  >       - Raw linseed oil is NOT a drying oil.  This does not mean it 
  > won't get
  >         drier, rather that its surface will not fully harden, remaining
  >         slightly oily/sticky and it may take quite a while to get to 
  > that
  >         point.
  >
  >       - Boiled linseed oil is a drying oil, and while the oil itself 
  > is not
  >         toxic (though I wouldn't recommend eating it), most commercial
  >         preparations of it have chemical additives which often are, 
  > some
  >         contain small amounts of heavy metals and most contain 
  > thinners which
  >         may or may not be toxic.  These additives are used to make it 
  > dry
  >         faster (even with them it takes days for one coat to dry).
  >
  >       - Material safety data sheet for the thinner in all of the 
  > different
  >         brands of conventional commercial preparations I have bought (I
  >         forget what thinner was used, possibly turpentine) indicated 
  > that
  >         breathing the thinner could cause "temporary" problems (I 
  > think brain
  >         and lungs).  I figure this is probably along the lines of the
  >         "temporary" effects of alcohol on the body i.e. people return 
  > to
  >         apparently normal functioning, but there are in fact minor 
  > levels of
  >         permanent and temporary damage (loss of brain cells, liver, 
  > etc.).
  >
  >       - Alternative formulations of boiled linseed oil are available 
  > using
  >         "non-toxic" thinners (citrus based thinners are among the more 
  > common
  >         ones).  Keep in mind that just because something is from a 
  > natural
  >         "non-toxic" source doesn't mean that it is completely safe, 
  > even
  >         water will kill you in sufficient quantities.  Some people do 
  > have
  >         problems with breathing these types of vapors as well.  These
  >         alternative formulations are a fair bit more expensive.
  >
  >       - In cool moist areas either boiled or raw linseed oil will 
  > support the
  >         growth of mold.
  >
  >       - I am planning on finishing a floor in my house while I am 
  > living in
  >         it, so I have been looking into alternatives to what I have 
  > used in
  >         the past, tung oil looks particularly interesting (though it's 
  > about
  >         3x the price of linseed oil) because it is a drying oil, is 
  > readily
  >         available without additives, and it is claimed that it won't 
  > support
  >         mold growth the way linseed oil will.  As far as I can tell, 
  > it is
  >         superior to Linseed oil in every regard except price and 
  > drying time
  >         (recommendations I have seen say 2+ days between coats, and 
  > weeks for
  >         full cure which is comparable to my experience with Linseed 
  > oil).
  >
  >   NOTE!!! When applying linseed oil, cover the surface in linseed oil,
  >   possibly let it soak in for a few minutes, then move any puddled oil 
  > onto
  >   an area of the floor that hasn't yet been oiled if there are no fresh
  >   areas of the floor to cover, soak up the excess oil with a rag.  
  > NEVER
  >   leave any puddles (no matter how small) of linseed oil on the floor.
  >   Puddled oil will dry on the surface of the puddle, trapping less 
  > dried oil
  >   inside the puddle which can literally take years to dry.  The result 
  > of
  >   this is that you can end up with a gummy mess when you walk on or set
  >   things on these semi-dried puddles.
  >
  >   ANOTHER NOTE!! Rags soaked in linseed oil will readily burst into 
  > flames
  >   (spontaneous combustion) as they are drying.  When you are done with 
  > the
  >   rags, spread them out flat in the sun in a non-flammable area and 
  > weight
  >   them down with rocks until they have dried, then place them in a 
  > tightly
  >   covered metal garbage can until they can be disposed of.
  >
  >   FWIW.
  >
  >   Shannon C. Dealy      |               DeaTech Research Inc.
  >   dealy at deatech.com     |          - Custom Software Development -
  >                          |    Embedded Systems, Real-time, Device 
  > Drivers
  >   Phone: (800) 467-5820 | Networking, Scientific & Engineering 
  > Applications
  >       or: (541) 929-4089 |                  www.deatech.com
  >
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