Rethink Your Life!
Finance, health, lifestyle, environment, philosophy 		The Work of Art and The Art of Work
Kiko Denzer on Art


Cob: Cob Homes in Canada?

D.J. Henman henman at it.to-be.co.jp
Sun Aug 10 22:23:54 CDT 2003 

Chandra,
   it is not surprising that you are confused about the meaning of what 
a masonry stove is.  The reason is that many masons tend to ignore or 
don't have accurate descriptions and simply say masonry, mainly to 
promote their trade and say its s simply a stove made out of masonry and 
can contain soil and cementitious mortars.  Russian stoves use thermal 
design principals to derive thermal benefits in a masonry stove, 
reportedly invented and initially designed in Russian by a Mr. 
Podgorodnikov.  So correctly, a masonry stove is simply any kind of 
stove made out of masonry.   A cob stove with or without rocks, designed 
properly can function in the same was as a cement and rock or lime and 
rock stove.   I believe the main area to be concerned with, if you use 
metal internal cavities, would be expansion and contraction of 
contiguous materials.   A buffer might be needed of air of a certain 
material.
 
A masonry stove can be a simple stove with no extra heat flow paths 
other than straight up the chimney.   The type of masonry stove Chandra 
is confusing with the generic term is the often more accurately referred 
to as kuznetov stoves or russian stoves, or russian fireplaces.
 
Additionally, the cob long chairs heated with a fire perform the same 
function in the same way as the stoves you are referring to, of course 
at a lower temperature and much, much less fuel required.  The principle 
is the same.   It could be designed and made as elaborate as you want, 
even with spiraling upward cavities.

here is some reference materials for you:

2.) "Kuznetsov has improved Russian heating stoves developed by I.S. 
Podgorodnikov, invented a number of Russian heating stoves of 
"double-deck hood" type, and integrated fireplace with stove. Russian 
heating stoves RTIK are very small in size but very efficient. They are 
heated over all their volume and, with only one daily heating, may be 
used for cooking day and night through."
   http://www.stove.ru/rtike.htm                     this site has some 
nice drawings.


3.)  From the below site whe have:
  "Using "system of free movement of gases" as a basis, Podgorodnikov 
I.S. designed series of stoves called "Teplushka" as well as a number of 
heating and heating/cooking "double bell" stoves. Stoves of his design 
were widely built in Russia, and earned a good reputation. The 
Podgorodnikov's "Teplushka" stove is still considered the best 
heating/cooking stove, even though most of these stoves are still built 
with imperfect, not airtight bakeoven doors."

http://mha-net.org/docs/v8n2/kuznetsov/freegasprinciple.doc

Hope this helps clear things up for you.   If I've missed something let 
me know.

Cheers,
   Darel
--------------------


Chandra Glick wrote:

> Darel, I'm not sure you know that a MASONRY stove is. It is a very 
> particular structure designed to burn hot and fast and hold the heat 
> from the fire for hours after the fire has gone out, slowly dispersing 
> the heat to the room. While earthen stoves have been made for ages, 
> few of them are actually masonry stoves. A kiva stove is not the same 
> thing.
>   -Chandra
>
>
> ----Original Message Follows----
> <massive snip>
> > If you do this, you may want to look into getting a masonry stove
> > (also theoretically could be made from cob).
>
> Not theoretical. Ovens and fireplaces (forgot the Indian name for them)
> have been made for ages. Some people have also made heated cob benches.
>
> Darel
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online  
> http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963
>
>
>
>
-------------- next part --------------
<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN">
<html>
<head>
  <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html;charset=ISO-8859-1">
  <title></title>
</head>
<body text="#000000" bgcolor="#ffffff">
Chandra,<br>
   it is not surprising that you are confused about the meaning of what
a masonry stove is.  The reason is that many masons tend to ignore or
don't have accurate descriptions and simply say masonry, mainly to
promote their trade and say its s simply a stove made out of masonry
and can contain soil and cementitious mortars.  Russian stoves use
thermal design principals to derive thermal benefits in a masonry
stove, reportedly invented and initially designed in Russian by <font
 size="-1">a Mr. <b>Podgorodnikov</b>.</font>  So correctly, a masonry
stove is simply any kind of stove made out of masonry.   A cob stove
with or without rocks, designed properly can function in the same was
as a cement and rock or lime and rock stove.   I believe the main area
to be concerned with, if you use metal internal cavities, would be
expansion and contraction of contiguous materials.   A buffer might be
needed of air of a certain material.<br>
 <br>
A masonry stove can be a simple stove with no extra heat flow paths
other than straight up the chimney.   The type of masonry stove Chandra
is confusing with the generic term is the often more accurately
referred to as kuznetov stoves or russian stoves, or russian
fireplaces. <br>
 <br>
Additionally, the cob long chairs heated with a fire perform the same
function in the same way as the stoves you are referring to, of course
at a lower temperature and much, much less fuel required.  The
principle is the same.   It could be designed and made as elaborate as
you want, even with spiraling upward cavities.<br>
<br>
here is some reference materials for you:<br>
<br>
2.) "<font face="MS Sans Serif" size="1">Kuznetsov has improved Russian
heating stoves developed by I.S. Podgorodnikov, invented a number of
Russian heating stoves of "double-deck hood" type, and integrated
fireplace with stove. Russian heating stoves RTIK are very small in
size but very efficient. They are heated over all their volume and,
with only one daily heating, may be used for cooking day and night
through."<br>
   <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.stove.ru/rtike.htm">http://www.stove.ru/rtike.htm</a>                     this site has some
nice drawings.<br>
<br>
<br>
3.)  From the below site whe have:<br>
  "</font><span lang="RU" style="font-size: 12pt;">Using “system of
free movement of gases” as a basis, Podgorodnikov I.S. designed series
of
stoves called “Teplushka” as well as a number of heating and
heating/cooking
“double bell” stoves. Stoves of his design were widely built in Russia,
and
earned a good reputation. The Podgorodnikov’s “Teplushka” stove is
still
considered the best heating/cooking stove, even though most of these
stoves are
still built with imperfect, not airtight bakeoven doors."<o:p></o:p></span>
<br>
<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://">http://</a><font size="-1"><font color="#008000">mha-net.org/docs/v8n2/kuznetsov/freegasprinciple.doc<br>
<br>
Hope this helps clear things up for you.   If I've missed something let
me know.<br>
</font></font><br>
Cheers,<br>
   Darel<br>
--------------------<br>
<br>
<br>
Chandra Glick wrote:<br>
<blockquote type="cite"
 cite="midBAY9-F770wmkibB9fBd00027012 at hotmail.com">Darel, I'm not sure
you know that a MASONRY stove is. It is a very particular structure
designed to burn hot and fast and hold the heat from the fire for hours
after the fire has gone out, slowly dispersing the heat to the room.
While earthen stoves have been made for ages, few of them are actually
masonry stoves. A kiva stove is not the same thing.
  <br>
  -Chandra
  <br>
  <br>
  <br>
----Original Message Follows----
  <br>
<massive snip>
  <br>
> If you do this, you may want to look into getting a masonry stove
  <br>
> (also theoretically could be made from cob).
  <br>
  <br>
Not theoretical. Ovens and fireplaces (forgot the Indian name for them)
  <br>
have been made for ages. Some people have also made heated cob benches.
  <br>
  <br>
Darel
  <br>
  <br>
_________________________________________________________________
  <br>
Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online 
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963">http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963</a>
  <br>
  <br>
  <br>
  <br>
  <br>
</blockquote>
</body>
</html>