Cob: Re: RE: Posts embedded in cob

[JOHN MAUGHAN]

Shawn, you might want to check on rammed earth construction .

Shawn Honeychurch wrote:

> Hi WillThank you so much for your suggestions.  You said you were
> building in BC interior.  Just curious if you were anywhere near us.
> We're in the Columbia Valley.  As for foundations, do you think in the
> semi-arid region where we are that we would near such a high one?  I
> was hoping to get away with a one foot above ground level (and 3 feet
> below) foundation so that the house could be low to the ground for
> easy access.  I was thinking of putting plastic (ug) ontop of a
> footing running the perimeter of the house and placing the posts and
> cob wall on that.  But I worry that this means the wall won't be
> breathing on its bottom edge and moisture could condense there.  Then
> again, it is very dry out here, so maybe that wouldn't be a problem.
> What do you think?Great idea with the pegs and stucco wire.  That
> makes alot of sense to me.  I'm so glad to have some input into these
> design problems and be able to address them BEFORE we begin building!
> Thanks!Robynn
>
>      ----- Original Message -----
>      From: Firstbrook, Will
>      To: 'Shawn Honeychurch' ; coblist at deatech.com
>      Sent: Wednesday, November 01, 2000 6:28 PM
>      Subject: Cob: RE: Posts embedded in cob
>       Hi Robynn,The answer to your questions are "it depends" on
>      the details. I helped build in a cob workshop a cob
>      structure that was post & beamed code approved. Although the
>      posts are visible on the outside. If interested you can
>      checkout the following pictures on my
>      website http://www.geocities.com/RainForest/Canopy/7148/cobpics.htmlThe
>      3rd & 4th picture from the end. Or
>      specifically: http://www.geocities.com/RainForest/Canopy/7148/ma4.jpg
>      &http://www.geocities.com/RainForest/Canopy/7148/ma3.jpg.You
>      can check out  http://www.life.ca/nl/74/straw.html  for more
>      details about straw-clay. It is good to have nails or pegs
>      in the posts to key-in the wall (regardless if it is cob,
>      straw-clay or strawbale). Yes you can cob over the posts.
>      Although if it is not a thick layer you might want to cover
>      the wood with tar paper and some screening material to
>      minimize cracking as the wood can dry out the cob or plaster
>      too fast compared to the rest of the wall.  You can use
>      galvanized stucco wire screening on both sides of the will
>      prior to cobbing or plastering the wall. This will
>      strengthen the wall and reduce any chance of the wall
>      falling over. Any bug problem can be addressed by the
>      finishing plasters. Cob, Straw-clay & strawbale all have one
>      common weakness water/moisture. This must be addressed by
>      the foundation design and materials and sufficient roof
>      overhangs. The stories you have heard about strawbale
>      failures are all related to excess moisture, water getting
>      into the wall and not getting out fast enough, rot & insects
>      occur when there is 20% or more moisture in the wall,
>      measured by weight. I am currently building a modified post
>      & beam strawbale house in the BC interior. It lived through
>      2 winters with raw bales exposed inside and out. Our family
>      of five lived in it through last winter there is no rot & no
>      bugs. After driving rain I have checked the bales, they are
>      dry as I have sufficient overhang. It all depends on the
>      details. I have a metal roof and a large foundation, The
>      bales are actually 5 feet off the ground and lifted 2" off
>      the floor so any plumbing water leak wont touch the bales. I
>      am using a sand, lime, clay, straw plaster to allow the
>      bales to breathe. Trapped water is the cause of most
>      rot.Regards,Will
>
>           -----Original Message-----
>           From: Shawn Honeychurch
>           [mailto:ironfire at cyberlink.bc.ca]
>           Sent: Wednesday, November 01, 2000 4:03 AM
>           To: Firstbrook, Will; coblist at deatech.com
>           Subject: Re: Posts embedded in cob
>
>           Hi WillThanks for your thoughts.  We really want
>           to go with the post and beam design, because it
>           will be easier for us to get a building permit.
>           With your staw-clay idea, how dense would you pack
>           it into the forms, do you think?  And could we
>           still cob over the posts?  Would cob on a straight
>           straw-clay be any stronger than a straight cob
>           wall?  I worry about it wanting to fall over,
>           being lighter weight and all.  The idea of
>           building faster and improved insulation value with
>           this method is, of course, appealing, but do you
>           think there is a greater risk of having bug
>           problems in a straw-clay wall than a cob wall? I
>           am not inclined to building with straw bales as I
>           have heard too many stories of problems with bugs
>           and rot.  Am I being paranoid as we live in a
>           semi-arid climate here? Thanks for your
>           input.Robynn
>
>
>
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Shawn, you might want to check on rammed earth construction .
<p>Shawn Honeychurch wrote:
<blockquote TYPE=CITE><style></style>
<font face="Arial"><font size=-1>Hi
Will</font></font><font face="Arial"><font size=-1>Thank you so much for
your suggestions.  You said you were building in BC interior. 
Just curious if you were anywhere near us. We're in the Columbia Valley. 
As for foundations, do you think in the semi-arid region where we are that
we would near such a high one?  I was hoping to get away with a one
foot above ground level (and 3 feet below) foundation so that the house
could be low to the ground for easy access.  I was thinking of putting
plastic (ug) ontop of a footing running the perimeter of the house and
placing the posts and cob wall on that.  But I worry that this means
the wall won't be breathing on its bottom edge and moisture could condense
there.  Then again, it is very dry out here, so maybe that wouldn't
be a problem.  What do you think?</font></font><font face="Arial"><font size=-1>Great
idea with the pegs and stucco wire.  That makes alot of sense to me. 
I'm so glad to have some input into these design problems and be able to
address them BEFORE we begin building!  Thanks!</font></font><font face="Arial"><font size=-1>Robynn</font></font>
<blockquote 
style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px">
<div style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message -----</div>

<div 
  style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><b>From:</b>
<a href="mailto:wfirstb1 at wcb.bc.ca" title="wfirstb1 at wcb.bc.ca">Firstbrook,
Will</a></div>

<div style="FONT: 10pt arial"><b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:ironfire at cyberlink.bc.ca" title="ironfire at cyberlink.bc.ca">'Shawn
Honeychurch'</a> ; <a href="mailto:coblist at deatech.com" title="coblist at deatech.com">coblist at deatech.com</a></div>

<div style="FONT: 10pt arial"><b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, November 01, 2000
6:28 PM</div>

<div style="FONT: 10pt arial"><b>Subject:</b> Cob: RE: Posts embedded in
cob</div>
 <span class=940300600-02112000><font face="Arial"><font color="#0000FF"><font size=-1>Hi
Robynn,</font></font></font></span><span class=940300600-02112000></span><span class=940300600-02112000><font face="Arial"><font color="#0000FF"><font size=-1>The
answer to your questions are "it depends" on the details. I helped build
in a cob workshop a cob structure that was post & beamed code approved.
Although the posts are visible on the outside. If interested you can 
checkout the following pictures on my website </font></font></font></span><span class=940300600-02112000></span><span class=940300600-02112000></span><font color="#0000FF"><font size=-1><a href="http://www.geocities.com/RainForest/Canopy/7148/cobpics.html">http://www.geocities.com/RainForest/Canopy/7148/cobpics.html</a></font></font><span class=940300600-02112000></span><span class=940300600-02112000><font face="Arial"><font color="#0000FF"><font size=-1>The
3rd & 4th picture from the end. Or specifically:</font></font></font> <font face="Arial"><font color="#0000FF"><font size=-1><a href="http://www.geocities.com/RainForest/Canopy/7148/ma4.jpg">http://www.geocities.com/RainForest/Canopy/7148/ma4.jpg</a>
&</font></font></font></span><span class=940300600-02112000></span><font size=-1><a href="http://www.geocities.com/RainForest/Canopy/7148/ma3.jpg"><font color="#0000FF">http://www.geocities.com/RainForest/Canopy/7148/ma3.jpg<span 
  class=940300600-02112000></font><font face="Arial"><font color="#800080">.</font></font></a></font></span><span class=940300600-02112000></span><span 
  class=940300600-02112000></span><span class=940300600-02112000><font face="Arial"><font color="#0000FF"><font size=-1>You
can check out  <a href="http://www.life.ca/nl/74/straw.html">http://www.life.ca/nl/74/straw.html</a> 
for more details about straw-clay. It is good to have nails or pegs in
the posts to key-in the wall (regardless if it is cob, straw-clay or strawbale).
Yes you can cob over the posts. Although if it is not a thick layer you
might want to cover the wood with tar paper and some screening material
to minimize cracking as the wood can dry out the cob or plaster too fast
compared to the rest of the wall.  You can use galvanized stucco wire
screening on both sides of the will prior to cobbing or plastering the
wall. This will strengthen the wall and reduce any chance of the wall falling
over. </font></font></font></span><span class=940300600-02112000></span><span class=940300600-02112000><font face="Arial"><font color="#0000FF"><font size=-1>Any
bug problem can be addressed by the finishing plasters. Cob, Straw-clay
& strawbale all have one common weakness water/moisture. This must
be addressed by the foundation design and materials and sufficient roof
overhangs. The stories you have heard about strawbale failures are all
related to excess moisture, water getting into the wall and not getting
out fast enough, rot & insects occur when there is 20% or more moisture
in the wall, measured by weight. </font></font></font></span><span class=940300600-02112000></span><span class=940300600-02112000><font face="Arial"><font color="#0000FF"><font size=-1>I
am currently building a modified post & beam strawbale house in the
BC interior. It lived through 2 winters with raw bales exposed inside and
out. Our family of five lived in it through last winter there is no rot
& no bugs. After driving rain I have checked the bales, they are dry
as I have sufficient overhang. It all depends on the details. I have a
metal roof and a large foundation, The bales are actually 5 feet off the
ground and lifted 2" off the floor so any plumbing water leak wont touch
the bales. I am using a sand, lime, clay, straw plaster to allow the bales
to breathe. Trapped water is the cause of most rot.</font></font></font></span><span class=940300600-02112000></span><span class=940300600-02112000><font face="Arial"><font color="#0000FF"><font size=-1>Regards,</font></font></font></span><span class=940300600-02112000><font face="Arial"><font color="#0000FF"><font size=-1>Will</font></font></font></span> 
<blockquote>
<div class=OutlookMessageHeader><font face="Times New Roman"><font size=-1>-----Original
Message-----</font></font>
<br><font face="Times New Roman"><font size=-1><b>From:</b> Shawn Honeychurch
[<a href="mailto:ironfire at cyberlink.bc.ca">mailto:ironfire at cyberlink.bc.ca</a>]</font></font>
<br><font face="Times New Roman"><font size=-1><b>Sent:</b> Wednesday,
November 01, 2000 4:03 AM</font></font>
<br><font face="Times New Roman"><font size=-1><b>To:</b> Firstbrook, Will;
<a href="mailto:coblist at deatech.com">coblist at deatech.com</a></font></font>
<br><font face="Times New Roman"><font size=-1><b>Subject:</b> Re: Posts
embedded in cob</font></font>
<br> </div>
<font face="Arial"><font size=-1>Hi Will</font></font><font face="Arial"><font size=-1>Thanks
for your thoughts.  We really want to go with the post and beam design,
because it will be easier for us to get a building permit.  With your
staw-clay idea, how dense would you pack it into the forms, do you think? 
And could we still cob over the posts?  Would cob on a straight straw-clay
be any stronger than a straight cob wall?  I worry about it wanting
to fall over, being lighter weight and all.  The idea of building
faster and improved insulation value with this method is, of course, appealing,
but do you think there is a greater risk of having bug problems in a straw-clay
wall than a cob wall?</font></font> <font face="Arial"><font size=-1>I
am not inclined to building with straw bales as I have heard too many stories
of problems with bugs and rot.  Am I being paranoid as we live in
a semi-arid climate here?</font></font> <font face="Arial"><font size=-1>Thanks
for your input.</font></font><font face="Arial"><font size=-1>Robynn</font></font> 
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</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
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