[Cob] forcing square cob home? Humboldt Alt Owner Builder

[William Pittman]

Charmine,

  I would appreciate the information you are offering.

  Also, I don't think belittling anyone's ideas is a way of progressing a
debate on a topic that most people on this list hold dear. Expressing
opinions and beliefs are one thing, but to mislabel someones intents is just
way too harsh. We all subscribe to this list in order to gather and share
information about building our own houses in a more natural, economical, and
sustainable way. There are multiple ways to solve this problem of building
codes. Some will be subtle and some will be blunt, but all are aiming to be
helpful. I ask of you, to hear others solutions with an open mind, and if
you can understand where they are coming from, maybe you can help them see
another side of the subject as well.

  While I don't like the prospect of a prefabbed home, people (because I
prefer to call them by the name of what they are and not a creature of famed
cliff jumping) of all walks of life may not have the same experiences,
initiative, or appropriate resources in their life to tell them that there
are other things out there than the norm. It's like a baby you need to potty
train (this is a simile, not an insult to people of the topic at hand), you
can either call the baby names for diddling in their diapers, or *help* them
*learn* about and *use* more sanitary ways of solving their problem.

So, are we here to call the diddling baby names or help it?

-William (Thomas)

On Sun, Feb 14, 2010 at 9:00 PM, <coblist-request at deatech.com> wrote:

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> Today's Topics:
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>   1. forcing square cob home? Humboldt Alt Owner Builder code- get
>      a copy (Charmaine Taylor)
>   2. Re: Engineered Cob House Plans (Janet Standeford)
>   3. Re: Engineered Cob House Plans (Janet Standeford)
>   4. Re: Engineered Cob House Plans (Barbara Roemer)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sat, 13 Feb 2010 12:37:07 -0800
> From: Charmaine Taylor <dirtcheapbuilderbooks at gmail.com>
> Subject: [Cob] forcing square cob home? Humboldt Alt Owner Builder
>        code- get       a copy
> To: coblist at deatech.com
> Message-ID:
>        <a28510c81002131237u1b0bb67fv45afb7ccb637be1f at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
>  Damon Howell wrote:
>   I'm sorry, but every time a new formless  building is erected with
> >>>  cob a disservice is done to our current  predicament . That would be
> >>>  that honest individuals who want to obey  the law cannot build
> >>>  because most cobbers are looked at as clueless.
>
>
> "our current  predicament "   Hummmm I am going to disagree.
>
>  Is  autocratic enforcement of square building to "prove" something to
>  building officials  the answer ?
>
> we don't need more laws enforcing creative, hard working people to fit
> a rigid,  codified system.  And why would you/anyone want  FORCE  the
> people who ARE being resourceful, debt-hating, green minded builders
> to build for   "OUR"  benefit?  Sounds communistic to me.
>
> Yes it may slow the  acceptance and code  permission to build a
> circular home, but what happened to just simple freedom?  Meeting
> every other demand for safety is enough:  plumbing, septic,
> electrical, etc.   Aren't cob homes in the round or spiral stronger
> anyway?
>
> Earthbags work great as infill to P&B framing too, but it should be a
> free choice when it is your own money and sweat equity.
>
>  I can EMAIL a copy  to anyone who asks of the 12-16 page Humboldt AOB
> code ( alternative owner builder)
>
>  it is mostly about  safety on placement of windows and doors for
> egress in a fire,  septic/safe waste handling, plumb & elec so you
> dont kill yourself or your family. Most builders I know are smart
> enough  to want to  do better than the code and build a strong safe
> home.
>
>
> anyway I will email  it free upon request- just write AOB in the
> subject so I know what you want.  I will ALSO send my older  website
> page on Codes- 10 page doc of   US Counties with their own building
> rules - from individual  people who wrote in to me and  explained
> their own county rules-- not all  counties are covered, but enough
> good info  to get a flavor of how different  the rules are USA wide.
> it would be nice if someone had the incentive to host a web page and
> offer a  builder contributed list  of county info-- in ONE place.
>
> --
> Conventional Home story-  A friend who was retiring 2 years ago  from
> a lifetime of work, and following the rules,  bought a  modest,
> smaller new home in the Sacramento area.. but there are  9 different
> bills  monthly  he never counted on,  costing him a few hundred a
> month- for special  water, lawn, rainwater fees, etc etc,  to meet
> city/ town laws all for 'better environment for all'.
>
> So expensive on a fixed income  he can't really sell ( now upside down
> in the mortgage by $35K too) and can't really afford to stay.. so  he
> is locked in and limited to do anything fun or even travel much in the
> 'golden years' It may takes years or a decade to even sell, or take an
> enormous hit on savings ( if any are left)
>
> Being able to find land that allows for Alternative Owner Builder,
> like a few counties in CA have, are where people are forced to build
> already.  enforcing even more rules further kills off any incentive to
> even try and build, which is maybe what the 'system' is based on....
> be a lemming and get a mortgage?
>
>
> Charmaine Taylor Publishing
> http://www.dirtcheapbuilder.com<< new owner-- free shipping on DVDs, CDs!
> http://www.amazon.com/shops/humboldtcoast
> Order: Tel: 406-287-3605 for Tom Elpel
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Sat, 13 Feb 2010 13:15:25 -0800
> From: Janet Standeford <janet.standeford at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Cob] Engineered Cob House Plans
> To: howard at earthandstraw.com, Cob List <coblist at deatech.com>
> Message-ID: <4B77166D.5030804 at gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> Hi Howard,
>  Re: Portland Cement being inappropriate:
>
> I know it is. But it is part of the code here for adobe and my Civil
> Engineer recommends approaching that subject just before putting it on.
> Of course it is only 3/4 of an inch thick and only on the outside, so it
> can at least breathe from the inside and who knows when it may need
> replacing? Hmmmm.
>
> Hopefully they will just allow me to do the right thing after hearing
> from other Inspectors and after talking it over with them.
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Sat, 13 Feb 2010 15:01:16 -0800
> From: Janet Standeford <janet.standeford at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Cob] Engineered Cob House Plans
> To: Cob List <coblist at deatech.com>
> Message-ID: <4B772F3C.6070508 at gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> Hi Charmaine,
>
> Please email me the info you mentioned. By the way, I am willing to host
> a web site just for the Builder's information you mentioned.
> If everyone here wants to use it I will go to the expense and time of
> putting it up. We could also have pages within it for every known cob
> project, past, present and future where you could write a synopsis of
> your project, the cost, time, a few very informative pictures, your
> Building Official's contact information, your contact information and a
> finished picture of you with your home.
>
> It would be nice if someone could volunteer some time and or money to
> get it up and running and keep it rolling. It won't be too expensive as
> I have hosting capability, in fact, if you donate $20 or more, I will
> also provide you with your own website, email addresses, etc for two
> years provided prices are not raised at the server level.
>
> In about a month and a half I need to pay approx $250 to keep the hosting
> going so that would help. I was looking at letting it go but in light of
> this idea am
> ready to sacrifice the time to put this together as well as work and build.
>
> I put a website like this together in 1998 for political purposes but it
> wasn't used so let that go. Any and all willing to to give input can do
> so. In fact I can link to this list subscription so nothing need be lost
> here and we can keep the site strictly for the information I mentioned.
>
> Anyone else game?
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Sat, 13 Feb 2010 23:10:44 -0800
> From: Barbara Roemer <roemiller4 at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Cob] Engineered Cob House Plans
> To: coblist at deatech.com
> Message-ID:
>        <6e41aaf41002132310n1b721cdbv8742b3a4d743061 at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Janet and others,
>
> This discussion about how or whether cob forms contribute to the difficulty
> with codes has been lively, and I'm glad to see it here with varied
> opinions.  I agree with Mark re absence of standardized materials being
> primarily responsible.
>
> It can be difficult to meld those standardized materials with less
> conventional ones that have other than standard properties. Cement plaster
> on an earthen wall would be one of those, IMO.  Now that you have tentative
> approval, perhaps you have some time to consider the cement plaster.
> Remembering the disaster of SW historic adobe buildings being "restored"
> and
> improved with cement stucco (which cracked miserably and fell off, to be
> replaced with, Ta Da: earthen plaster), I would strongly consider lime
> plaster.  John Glassford, a crazy and most helpful Aussie bale builder, has
> a great web site with lots of photos.  He currently puts down an earthen
> base (IIRC), full wall sheets of fiberglass mesh, including right over the
> plate, and then shoots on lime plaster made with sacked lime, not lime
> putty.  You can read his posts on the Yahoo Bale list, or see some pics
> below.  He's extremely responsive to queries, so contact him.
>
> http://glassford.com.au/main/?attachment_id=2082
>
> Keep us posted.
>
> Admiring your tenacity and willingness to meet the building dept in the
> middle,
>
> Barbara
> Sierra Foothills
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
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> End of Coblist Digest, Vol 8, Issue 28
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>