Cob: Paint on cob

Thu Mar 6 14:15:06 CST 2003

Joe,
I built a small experimental building - cob chicken coop/greenhouse/garden shed and used several finishes on various parts of the building just to see what would happen. The lime I used was the bagged powdered construction lime available at Home Depot. I mixed the lime with water and let it soak for about a month. The lime white wash came right off with the first rain. I plastered with a mixture of lime/sand/clay. It didn't wash off, but crumbled like a cookie with a bump of a shovel handle. I tried a mixture of lime and sand, and plastered in temperate, misty weather so it would dry slow. the lime plaster cracked and came off in chunks in some places, but seemed to last a little longer in areas where I used a very high concentration of sand. Even tried straight latex paint over smooth finish of cob (this comment I made earlier started the whole train on this subject). The paint over smooth cob lasted the longest. It did peal right off in a few places where water got behind the paint (around window frame). I understand why we shouldn't be using latex paint on cob, so don't get me wrong I'm not suggesting that anyone else do this - remember it was an experimental building. I sure would like to get this right before its time to plaster the house I'm building. Also, if there's a better source for lime, I'd like to know. 
thanks,
Dorothy 
 Joe Skeesick <joe at skeesick.com> wrote:
can you use the natural paints and tinted renders on exterior walls? and if so, how well will they hold up? assuming you have 2 to 3 foot overhangs and 3 foot stem walls to keep splashing rain off. I haven't been able to find anything to stand up to our crazy texas storms. 
Dorothy 
 Joe Skeesick <joe at skeesick.com> wrote:

v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}.shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
Point of clarification. (at least I hope) 

v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}.shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
A lime render (either tinted or natural white) is the perfect final render for the outside of cob homes. It protects the homes here in England quite well. If you need help finding resources for lime renders I can see what I can do. However, most of the resources I know of are on this side of the pond right now. I�ll have to find the resources over there soon enough (I�m building a cob home in Oklahoma in a year and a half) but haven�t done so yet. 

Lime renders take salt spray and coastal storms well. It is also used in the Mediterranean countries and stands up to direct sun and heat as well. I think it would serve your needs well.

J

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

can you use the natural paints and tinted renders on exterior walls? and if so, how well will they hold up? assuming you have 2 to 3 foot overhangs and 3 foot stem walls to keep splashing rain off.  I haven't been able to find anything to stand up to our crazy Texas storms. 

Dorothy 

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-coblist at deatech.com [mailto:owner-coblist at deatech.com]On Behalf Of Dorothy Bothne
Sent: Thursday, March 06, 2003 6:10 PM
To: coblist at deatech.com
Subject: RE: Cob: Paint on cob

Natural paints and tinted renders tend to act more like stains allowing for cob (or strawbale) to dry out properly. Modern latex and oil based paints however act as sealants on the wall and can lead to ugly problems on cob walls. 

I am assuming that this later paint is what was being referred to (since that was the type being discussed when this thread started). I just didnt want folks to be scared off of the natural coloring options available to them for their structures. 

If however you were speaking on a more global anti-paint platform, please explain. It would be the first I heard negative comments about the natural paints.

Joe

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-coblist at deatech.com [mailto:owner-coblist at deatech.com]On Behalf Of Yun Que
Sent: Thursday, March 06, 2003 3:54 PM
To: coblist at deatech.com
Subject: Re: Cob: Paint on cob

Cat here,  Yes on the no paint thing!  Natural wood, earth, stone holds a quality that is easy on the eye and for those of us who do not enjoy cleaning too often these materials patina great!!!!

for the good of all C

>From: Darel Henman 

>Reply-To: Darel Henman 

>To: Kim West 

>CC: Cob List 

>Subject: Re: Cob: Paint on cob 

>Date: Thu, 06 Mar 2003 14:10:28 +0900 

> 

>Kim, 

> don't put paint on cob. Too many people think a cob wall will 

>disintergrate at the first rain and this is untrue. I have seen hundred 

>year old daub buildings with NO lime plaster, just the rough daub still 

>in pretty good condition. It had a proper roof. It wasn't but could 

>be replastered with a clay straw plaster if wanted every so often. A 

>lime and sand or lime and fibre would probably help it last a bit 

>longer. A lime and clay soil with maybe some sand and soft fibre would 

>work as well. But the cute little daub building I saw was still 

>functional as it was a hundred years ago as a little shed. I've seen 

>houses about two hundred years old as well with just the daub/cob 

>finish. Cob once dried and cured is very strong. 

> 

> Of course, one must consider your area and the quality of your mix. 

> 

> Not related, but in general paint sucks. Leave things their natural 

>color. If you have a mental thing about painting everything, use a 

>natural oil or wax for wood. 

> 

>Darel 

> 

> > Kim West wrote: 

> > 

> > I read where someone here used latex paint on cob and it peeled off. I 

> > was wondering if anyone has used a store bought water based/flat 

> > paint, and if so, how did it do on the cob? Thanks. 

> > 

> > Kim 

> 

---------------------------------

Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8.

---------------------------------

Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, and more

---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, and more
-------------- next part --------------
<P>Joe,
<P>I built a small experimental building - cob chicken coop/greenhouse/garden shed and used several finishes on various parts of the building just to see what would happen.  The lime I used was the bagged powdered  construction lime available at Home Depot.  I mixed the lime with water and let it soak for about a month.  The lime white wash came right off with the first rain.  I plastered with a mixture of lime/sand/clay. It didn't wash off, but crumbled like a cookie with a bump of a shovel handle.   I tried a mixture of lime and sand, and plastered in temperate, misty weather so it would dry slow.  the lime plaster cracked and came off in chunks in some places, but seemed to last a little longer in areas where I used a very high concentration of sand. Even tried straight latex paint over smooth finish of cob (this comment I made earlier started the whole train on this subject).  The paint over smooth cob lasted the longest.  It did peal right off in a few places where water got behind the paint (around window frame).  I understand why we shouldn't be using latex paint on cob, so don't get me wrong I'm not suggesting that anyone else do this - remember it was an experimental building.  I sure would like to get this right before its time to plaster the house I'm building.  Also, if there's a better source for lime, I'd like to know.  
<P>thanks,
<P>Dorothy 
<P> <B><I>Joe Skeesick <joe at skeesick.com></I></B> wrote:
<BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid">
<P>can you use the natural paints and tinted renders on exterior walls? and if so, how well will they hold up? assuming you have 2 to 3 foot overhangs and 3 foot stem walls to keep splashing rain off.  I haven't been able to find anything to stand up to our crazy texas storms. 
<P>Dorothy 
<P> <B><I>Joe Skeesick <joe at skeesick.com></I></B> wrote: 
<BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid">
<META content=Word.Document name=ProgId>
<META content="Microsoft Word 9" name=Generator>
<META content="Microsoft Word 9" name=Originator><LINK href="cid:filelist.xml at 01C2E404.8F4AC7C0" rel=File-List><LINK href="cid:editdata.mso at 01C2E404.8F4AC7C0" rel=Edit-Time-Data>
<STYLE>
v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
.shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
</STYLE>

<STYLE>
<!--
 /* Font Definitions */
@font-face
	{font-family:Tahoma;
	panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;
	mso-font-charset:0;
	mso-generic-font-family:swiss;
	mso-font-pitch:variable;
	mso-font-signature:1627421319 -2147483648 8 0 66047 0;}
 /* Style Definitions */
p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal
	{mso-style-parent:"";
	margin:0in;
	margin-bottom:.0001pt;
	mso-pagination:widow-orphan;
	font-size:12.0pt;
	font-family:"Times New Roman";
	mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman";}
a:link, span.MsoHyperlink
	{color:blue;
	text-decoration:underline;
	text-underline:single;}
a:visited, span.MsoHyperlinkFollowed
	{color:blue;
	text-decoration:underline;
	text-underline:single;}
p.MsoAutoSig, li.MsoAutoSig, div.MsoAutoSig
	{margin:0in;
	margin-bottom:.0001pt;
	mso-pagination:widow-orphan;
	font-size:12.0pt;
	font-family:"Times New Roman";
	mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman";}
p
	{margin-right:0in;
	mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
	mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;
	margin-left:0in;
	mso-pagination:widow-orphan;
	font-size:12.0pt;
	font-family:"Times New Roman";
	mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman";}
span.EmailStyle19
	{mso-style-type:personal-reply;
	mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
	mso-ascii-font-family:Arial;
	mso-hansi-font-family:Arial;
	mso-bidi-font-family:Arial;
	color:navy;}
@page Section1
	{size:8.5in 11.0in;
	margin:1.0in 1.25in 1.0in 1.25in;
	mso-header-margin:.5in;
	mso-footer-margin:.5in;
	mso-paper-source:0;}
div.Section1
	{page:Section1;}
-->
</STYLE>

<DIV class=Section1>
Point of clarification. (at least I hope) 
<META content=Word.Document name=ProgId>
<META content="Microsoft Word 9" name=Generator>
<META content="Microsoft Word 9" name=Originator><LINK href="cid:filelist.xml at 01C2E410.E1EC88E0" rel=File-List><LINK href="cid:editdata.mso at 01C2E410.E1EC88E0" rel=Edit-Time-Data>
<STYLE>
v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
.shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
</STYLE>

<STYLE>
<!--
 /* Font Definitions */
@font-face
	{font-family:Tahoma;
	panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;
	mso-font-charset:0;
	mso-generic-font-family:swiss;
	mso-font-pitch:variable;
	mso-font-signature:1627421319 -2147483648 8 0 66047 0;}
 /* Style Definitions */
p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal
	{mso-style-parent:"";
	margin:0in;
	margin-bottom:.0001pt;
	mso-pagination:widow-orphan;
	font-size:12.0pt;
	font-family:"Times New Roman";
	mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman";}
a:link, span.MsoHyperlink
	{color:blue;
	text-decoration:underline;
	text-underline:single;}
a:visited, span.MsoHyperlinkFollowed
	{color:blue;
	text-decoration:underline;
	text-underline:single;}
p.MsoAutoSig, li.MsoAutoSig, div.MsoAutoSig
	{margin:0in;
	margin-bottom:.0001pt;
	mso-pagination:widow-orphan;
	font-size:12.0pt;
	font-family:"Times New Roman";
	mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman";}
p
	{margin-right:0in;
	mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
	mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;
	margin-left:0in;
	mso-pagination:widow-orphan;
	font-size:12.0pt;
	font-family:"Times New Roman";
	mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman";}
span.emailstyle19
	{mso-style-name:emailstyle19;}
span.EmailStyle20
	{mso-style-type:personal-reply;
	mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
	mso-ascii-font-family:Arial;
	mso-hansi-font-family:Arial;
	mso-bidi-font-family:Arial;
	color:navy;}
@page Section1
	{size:8.5in 11.0in;
	margin:1.0in 1.25in 1.0in 1.25in;
	mso-header-margin:.5in;
	mso-footer-margin:.5in;
	mso-paper-source:0;}
div.Section1
	{page:Section1;}
-->
</STYLE>

<DIV class=Section1>
A lime render (either tinted or natural white) is the perfect final render for the outside of cob homes. It protects the homes here in England quite well. If you need help finding resources for lime renders I can see what I can do. However, most of the resources I know of are on this side of the pond right now. I�ll have to find the resources over there soon enough (I�m building a cob home in Oklahoma in a year and a half) but haven�t done so yet. <?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o:p></o:p>
 <o:p></o:p>
Lime renders take salt spray and coastal storms well. It is also used in the Mediterranean countries and stands up to direct sun and heat as well. I think it would serve your needs well.<o:p></o:p>
 <o:p></o:p>
J<o:p></o:p>
 <o:p></o:p>
 <o:p></o:p>
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------<o:p></o:p>
can you use the natural paints and tinted renders on exterior walls? and if so, how well will they hold up? assuming you have 2 to 3 foot overhangs and 3 foot stem walls to keep splashing rain off.  I haven't been able to find anything to stand up to our crazy Texas storms. <o:p></o:p>
Dorothy <o:p></o:p>
 <o:p></o:p>
 <o:p></o:p>
-----Original Message----- From: owner-coblist at deatech.com [mailto:owner-coblist at deatech.com]On Behalf Of Dorothy Bothne Sent: Thursday, March 06, 2003 6:10 PM To: coblist at deatech.com Subject: RE: Cob: Paint on cob
 <o:p></o:p>
 <o:p></o:p>
 <o:p></o:p>
Natural paints and tinted renders tend to act more like stains allowing for cob (or strawbale) to dry out properly. Modern latex and oil based paints however act as sealants on the wall and can lead to ugly problems on cob walls. <o:p></o:p>
 <o:p></o:p>
I am assuming that this later paint is what was being referred to (since that was the type being discussed when this thread started). I just didnt want folks to be scared off of the natural coloring options available to them for their structures. <o:p></o:p>
 <o:p></o:p>
If however you were speaking on a more global anti-paint platform, please explain. It would be the first I heard negative comments about the natural paints.<o:p></o:p>
 <o:p></o:p>
Joe<o:p></o:p>
 <o:p></o:p>
 <o:p></o:p>
 <o:p></o:p>
-----Original Message----- From: owner-coblist at deatech.com [mailto:owner-coblist at deatech.com]On Behalf Of Yun Que Sent: Thursday, March 06, 2003 3:54 PM To: coblist at deatech.com Subject: Re: Cob: Paint on cob<o:p></o:p>
 <o:p></o:p>
Cat here,  Yes on the no paint thing!  Natural wood, earth, stone holds a quality that is easy on the eye and for those of us who do not enjoy cleaning too often these materials patina great!!!!<o:p></o:p>
for the good of all C<o:p></o:p>
>From: Darel Henman <HENMAN at IT.TO-BE.CO.JP><o:p></o:p>
>Reply-To: Darel Henman <HENMAN at IT.TO-BE.CO.JP><o:p></o:p>
>To: Kim West <KWEST at ARKANSAS.NET><o:p></o:p>
>CC: Cob List <COBLIST at DEATECH.COM><o:p></o:p>
>Subject: Re: Cob: Paint on cob <o:p></o:p>
>Date: Thu, 06 Mar 2003 14:10:28 +0900 <o:p></o:p>
> <o:p></o:p>
>Kim, <o:p></o:p>
> don't put paint on cob. Too many people think a cob wall will <o:p></o:p>
>disintergrate at the first rain and this is untrue. I have seen hundred <o:p></o:p>
>year old daub buildings with NO lime plaster, just the rough daub still <o:p></o:p>
>in pretty good condition. It had a proper roof. It wasn't but could <o:p></o:p>
>be replastered with a clay straw plaster if wanted every so often. A <o:p></o:p>
>lime and sand or lime and fibre would probably help it last a bit <o:p></o:p>
>longer. A lime and clay soil with maybe some sand and soft fibre would <o:p></o:p>
>work as well. But the cute little daub building I saw was still <o:p></o:p>
>functional as it was a hundred years ago as a little shed. I've seen <o:p></o:p>
>houses about two hundred years old as well with just the daub/cob <o:p></o:p>
>finish. Cob once dried and cured is very strong. <o:p></o:p>
> <o:p></o:p>
> Of course, one must consider your area and the quality of your mix. <o:p></o:p>
> <o:p></o:p>
> Not related, but in general paint sucks. Leave things their natural <o:p></o:p>
>color. If you have a mental thing about painting everything, use a <o:p></o:p>
>natural oil or wax for wood. <o:p></o:p>
> <o:p></o:p>
>Darel <o:p></o:p>
> <o:p></o:p>
> > Kim West wrote: <o:p></o:p>
> > <o:p></o:p>
> > I read where someone here used latex paint on cob and it peeled off. I <o:p></o:p>
> > was wondering if anyone has used a store bought water based/flat <o:p></o:p>
> > paint, and if so, how did it do on the cob? Thanks. <o:p></o:p>
> > <o:p></o:p>
> > Kim <o:p></o:p>
> <o:p></o:p>
 <o:p></o:p>
<DIV class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-LEFT: 1in; TEXT-ALIGN: center" align=center>
<HR align=center width="100%" SIZE=2>
</DIV>
Tired of spam? Get <A href="http://g.msn.com/8HMNENUS/2734">advanced junk mail protection</A> with MSN 8.<o:p></o:p>
 <o:p></o:p>
<DIV class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in; TEXT-ALIGN: center" align=center>
<HR align=center width="100%" SIZE=1>
</DIV>
Do you Yahoo!? <A href="http://rd.yahoo.com/finance/mailtagline/*http://taxes.yahoo.com/">Yahoo! Tax Center</A> - forms, calculators, tips, and more<o:p></o:p></DIV></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE> <hr size=1>Do you Yahoo!? 
<a href="http://rd.yahoo.com/finance/mailtagline/*http://taxes.yahoo.com/">Yahoo! Tax Center</a> - forms, calculators, tips, and more

Rethink Your Life! Finance, health, lifestyle, environment, philosophy	The Work of Art and The Art of Work Kiko Denzer on Art